74 slain at oil field in Ethiopia

Tue, 24 Apr 2007 16:45:35

At least 74 workers have been killed in an attack on a Chinese-run oil field in eastern Ethiopia, an official of the Chinese company said Tuesday.

"The attack happened this morning. Nine Chinese were killed, seven Chinese workers were kidnapped and 65 locals were killed," said Xu Shuang, the general manager of Zhongyuan Petroleum Exploration Bureau, based in Addis Ababa, told The Associated Press.

Pentagon opens civilian claim files against military: Chilling accounts of fatalities

Related
ACLU Releases Files on Civilian Casualties in Afghanistan and Iraq: See story and link to database following this story.
---
Chilling accounts of civilian fatalities in Iraq and Afghanistan released under freedom of information act.

Ewen MacAskill in Washington
Friday April 13, 2007
The Guardian

Chilling accounts of hundreds of fatal encounters between the US military and civilians in Iraq and Afghanistan, providing a rare glimpse of the confusion and chaos of daily life in the conflict zones, were released by the Pentagon yesterday under the freedom of information act.

Four hundred and ninety-six files deal with Iraqi claims for compensation for family members killed by US forces between 2003 and 2006 and 17 from Afghanistan. The files, including handwritten notes from some of the soldiers involved, record the deaths of civilians killed mainly at checkpoints, or in their homes, or when US forces sprayed roads with gunfire to protect convoys.

---

---

Many of the deaths result from a failure of communication between US forces, most of whom do not speak Arabic, and civilians. Among the files is one relating to a mother shot dead and her two children wounded when the taxi they were in went through a checkpoint at Baqubah, north of Baghdad, in February last year.

The US defence department file said: "While the matter is still under investigation, there is evidence to suggest that the warning cones and printed checkpoint signs had not yet been displayed in front of the checkpoint, which may be the reason why the driver of the taxi did not believe he was required to stop." The case has since been resolved and the US military has paid out $7,500 (£3,750).

Another file, from the 101st Airborne Division, deals with a claim for $4,800 from a father whose son was shot dead in a car at a checkpoint between Baghdad and Kirkuk in 2005. A sergeant dealing with it writes: "How was he supposed to know to get out of the vehicle when they fired warning shots? If I was in his place I would have stayed put too." In spite of his comments, the claim was turned down.

The defence department paid out $2,500 in another case, near Tuz in eastern Iraq, in which four family members were killed at their home in March 2004. The file records that more than 100 rounds were fired, so indiscriminate that 32 sheep and a cow were also killed.

The files were released after a request by the American Civil Liberties Union and amount to only a fraction of civilian deaths at the hands of US troops and the compensation claims lodged. Of the 496 Iraq claims released yesterday, cash payments were made in 164 cases.

Marc Garlasco, a spokesman for Human Rights Watch, said what he found shocking was the lack of consistency in deciding who was entitled to compensation.

---

ACLU Releases Files on Civilian Casualties in Afghanistan and Iraq (4/12/2007)

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
CONTACT: media@aclu.org

Americans Have a Right to Unfiltered Information About the Human Costs of War, ACLU Says

NEW YORK - The American Civil Liberties Union today made public hundreds of claims for damages by family members of civilians killed or injured by Coalition Forces in Iraq and Afghanistan. The ACLU received the records in response to a Freedom of Information Act request it filed in June 2006.

The hundreds of files provide a vivid snapshot, in significantly more detail than has previously been compiled and released, of the circumstances surrounding reports of civilian deaths in Iraq and Afghanistan.

"Since U.S. troops first set foot in Afghanistan in 2001, the Defense Department has gone to unprecedented lengths to control and suppress information about the human costs of war," said Anthony D. Romero, Executive Director of the ACLU. "Our democracy depends on an informed citizenry, and it is critical that the American people have access to full and accurate information about the prosecution of the war and the implications for innocent civilians."

The ACLU pointed out that during both the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq, the Defense Department has instituted numerous policies designed to control information about the human costs of war. These policies include:

• Banning photographers on U.S. military bases from covering the arrival of caskets containing the remains of U.S. soldiers killed overseas;
• Paying Iraqi journalists to write positive accounts of the U.S. war effort;
• Inviting U.S. journalists to "embed" with military units but requiring them to submit their stories for pre-publication review;
• Erasing journalists' footage of civilian deaths in Afghanistan; and
• Refusing to disclose statistics on civilian casualties.

The files made public today are claims submitted to the U.S. Foreign Claims Commissions by surviving Iraqi and Afghan family members of civilians said to have been killed or injured or to have suffered property damages due to actions by Coalition Forces. The ACLU released a total of 496 files: 479 from Iraq and 17 from Afghanistan. The documents released by the ACLU are available online in a searchable database at www.aclu.org/civiliancasualties

Most of the Iraq claims range from early 2003 to late 2006; the majority are from 2005. Most claims from Afghanistan are from May 2006, with one dating back to 2001. Based on the number of deaths represented and the variation in number and location of claims per year, the ACLU said it believes there are additional documents being withheld and is pressing the Defense Department to disclose them all.

Of the 496 files, 198 were denied because the military found that the incidents arose "from action by an enemy or resulted directly or indirectly from an act of the armed forces of the United States in combat," which the military calls "combat exclusion."

Of the 496 claims, 164 incidents resulted in cash payments to family members. In approximately half of the cash payment cases, the United States accepted responsibility for the death of the civilian and offered a "compensation payment." In the other half, U.S. authorities issued "condolence" payments, which are discretionary payments capped at $2,500 and offered "as an expression of sympathy" but "without reference to fault." Claims based on incidents that were not reported in the military's "SIGACT" ("significant act") database, despite eyewitness corroborations, are generally denied for compensation although a condolence payment may be issued.

The files provide a window into the lives of innocent Afghans and Iraqis caught in conflict zones. In one file, a civilian from the Salah Ad Din (PDF) province in eastern Iraq states that U.S. forces opened fire with more than 100 hundred rounds on his sleeping family, killing his mother, father and brother. The firepower was of such magnitude that 32 of the family's sheep were also killed. The Army acknowledged responsibility and the claim resulted in two payments: a compensation payment of $11,200 and a $2,500 condolence payment. In another file, a civilian in Baghdad states that his only son, a nine-year-old (PDF), was playing outside when a stray bullet hit and killed him. The Army acknowledged responsibility and paid compensation of $4,000.

"As these files remind us, war imposes heavy burdens on innocent civilians," said Jameel Jaffer, Deputy Director of the ACLU's National Security Program. "Although these files are deeply disturbing to read, they allow us to understand the human cost of war in a way that statistics and the usual platitudes do not."

The ACLU noted that a significant number of the files - 92 of 496 - relate to deaths at checkpoints (50 files) or near American convoys (42 files). In one file, a civilian states that his son drove up to a checkpoint (PDF) in Kirkuk, was shot at through the roof of the car and hit in the abdomen; he later died from his wounds. An e-mail in the file from an Army sergeant states: "How was he supposed to know to get out of the vehicle when they fired warning shots? If I was in his place I would have stayed put too." The claim was denied although the sergeant suggested that the civilian might seek a condolence payment.

In another file, a civilian states that his mother was killed (PDF), his four-year-old brother suffered shrapnel wounds to the head, and his sister was shot in the leg after the taxi they were riding in ran through a checkpoint in the eastern Iraq town of Baqubah. An Army memorandum states: "[T]here is evidence to suggest that the warning cones and printed checkpoint signs had not yet been displayed in front of the checkpoint, which may be the reason why the driver of the Taxi did not believe he was required to stop." The Army suggested a condolence payment of $7,500. It is not known whether it was granted.

Attorneys on the FOIA project are Jaffer and Nasrina Bargzie of the national ACLU.

In a separate project, the ACLU filed a FOIA request in October 2003 for records concerning the abuse of prisoners held by U.S. forces in Iraq, Afghanistan, and Guantánamo Bay. To date, that request has resulted in the release of more than 100,000 pages, all of which are available online at: www.aclu.org/torturefoia. Litigation regarding that FOIA request is ongoing.

Democrats' Victory Means More Iraqi Deaths: End the War, Then Impeach

March 26, 2007

By SUNSARA TAYLOR

"House, 218 to 212, Votes to Set Date for Iraq Pullout" reads the New York Times. "Democrats Tout Plan for Troop Pullout," headlines the Washington Post. "Pelosi's Gamble on Iraq Pays Off," beams the Los Angeles Times. The reader is to believe that the Democrats have "employ[ed] their new Congressional majority to create the most forceful challenge yet to President Bush's war policy."

Today's headlines are parroting the lies of pro-war politicians -- AGAIN!

Today, the lying headlines borrow from the script of leading Democrats, but are every bit as dangerous as the headlines that repeated George Bush's claims four years ago that Iraq had WMDs.

Today's lying headlines are declaring a "victory" against George Bush's murderous Iraq war and working to lull into satisfied passivity the people who need to be raising their voices and raising hell right now more than ever!

As Howard Zinn put it, "To me [this vote] is tantamount to the abolitionists accepting a two-year timeline for ending slavery, while giving more money to enforce the Fugitive Slave Act."

To everyone who was relying on or hoping that the Democrats would act to end the war, the actions of the Democratic leadership are a sharp wake-up call. Only the people in our millions, mobilized in massive and ongoing resistance, can bring this war and this president's whole program to a halt.

Buried is the real story of:

How Nancy Pelosi, Rahm Emmanuel, Jack Murtha and other leading Democrats maneuvered, bribed, threatened, reprimanded and bullied their party into voting to continue the war on Iraq in the face of overwhelming, widespread, deeply-felt, and growing public opposition.

How the new appropriations bill continues to fund Bush's wars to the tune of $124 billion dollars -- more than Bush even asked for!!

How the timetable for withdrawal from Iraq in the bill is so distant (seventeen months away!) it can mean nothing to the people of Iraq whose country is under the ruthless boot of U.S. occupation and is spiraling down a path of sectarian civil war that grows worse by the day.

How this timetable is so conditional -- insisting merely that Bush seek the approval of Congress before extending the date by which troops are supposed to be withdrawn -- that it is easy to imagine that deadline coming and going with no meaningful change in troop levels.

How the new bill -- and the politicians who pushed it -- put the onus for Iraq's misery on the Iraqi people themselves, demanding they meet benchmarks determined by the country that illegally invaded it! Closing the arguments for the Democrats just before the vote, Representative Patrick Murphy of Pennsylvania, asked, "When are these Iraqis going to come off the sidelines and fight for their own country?"

And barely mentioned in today's lying headlines is the fact that liberal Democrats had originally proposed an appropriations amendment that would only have provided enough funds to bring the troops back from Iraq and that this wasn't even allowed by leading Democrats to make it out of the committee to be considered by Congress.

Finally, who could ignore Bush's brazen promise to veto this new bill anyhow and the Democrats know they don't have enough votes to override him?

In the words of White House spokesman, Tony Snow, "You've got to ask yourself, why go through this long, drawn out exercise of going and wheeling and cajoling and trying to buy votes within your own party when, in fact, you know its not going to go anywhere?"

Anyway you slice it, yesterday's vote is no "victory" for the people of this country, of Iraq, or of the world, all of whom overwhelmingly oppose the Iraq war and are aching for it to be stopped. Instead it means that after four years of war crimes, massacres, rapes, torture and what can only be called a colonial occupation that has cost more than half a million deaths and led to the fastest growing refugee crises in the world, the Iraqi people must now brace themselves for more!

This is a moment that cries for clarity and boldness among those who are able to see the stakes of this, actions and voices that can cut through the lies about a "victory" that threaten to quiet and pacify the anti-war movement right when it needs to be louder than ever before.

The war must be stopped! The War-Criminal-In-Chief must be impeached!

Self-deception or self-censorship about this right now will be paid for in blood. But bold truth telling and defiant political actions will find a wide and receptive audience in the anti-war majority. This majority has begun to reemerge in the streets across the country, on the Pentagon, and in recent student strikes. Whether this spreads like wildfire or is dampened at this critical moment is up to all of us.

Sunsara Taylor writes for Revolution Newspaper and sits on the Advisory Board of The World Can't Wait ­ Drive Out the Bush Regime. She can be reached at: sunsarasworld@yahoo.com

Video: American soldiers shooting civilians

Video

Comments

USAn: ...and feeling kind-of sick...
Absolutely incredible, absolutely incredible...

What we have here are TYPICAL AMERIKKKKKKKKAN THUGS....ARROGANT, FASCIST, RACIST, STOMACH-TURNINGLY VILE, THUGS - NOT HUMANS AT ALL, BUT MONSTERS. ABSOLUTE, NON-HUMAN, MONSTERS. As far as I'm concerned, THEY HAVE FORFEITED THEIR RIGHT TO LIVE ON THIS PLANET.1

March 24, 2007
Resistant: The voices of imperial racism
Custer & company before the Little Bighorn.

2

March 24, 2007
homero: ...
There is the joy of cooking; the joy of love; the joy of music. For many of our soldiers in Iraq it is the joy of killing. This is what the videos shows: the joy of it. These American boys are truly and really enjoying themselves. And sooner or latter these same boys are going to come home. They will be working in the Post Office, or as Police, or better still as prison guards. 3

March 24, 2007
GreyRaven: The American pantywaiste culture
Don’t feel bad. It’s just a couple of war criminals committing some war crimes that you’ve seen. You were able to watch it live on UTube. Isn’t that exciting? But it’s also sort of terrible isn’t it? Just to make you feel better though, I’d like to remind you that America is still the Greatest Country in the World.

So, come on, man. Who gives a shit? It’s just a couple of ragheads they're firing upon, isn’t it? Nobody cares about them fuckers. Just shoot them up and take the fuckers down. Nobody is going to miss them.

As it happened, there were just innocent civilians in those cars.

I sort of wonder what America would think if this had taken place in downtown L.A. Can you imagine how everyone would be crapping in their pants right now? They would be screaming holy shit, the hypocritical bastards.

As you sow so shall you reap, the saying goes. I wonder how America will deal with that which it shall reap. It will probably be really messy. We shall then see who the pantywaists really are. Some of the big talkers will fit right in, I'm sure.

4

March 24, 2007
Not_An_American: Well one thing is for certain
They aren't what I would call professional soldiers...and I bet every one of them would have soiled their pants if they received some incoming. Pity a really good Iraqi sniper didn't off one of them to give them a taste of it.5

March 24, 2007
USAn: ...
They are all exactly like the young, ignorant, whitebread, suburban, republican, big SUV driving, young USAn males, currently filling all the in the bars on Carson street right now, watching basketball...

In the name of GOD I hate USAns! And hating my neighbors and everyone around me is not good for my health. Look at what happened to Prof. Tanya Reinhart, she was in fine health but died of a stroke at 62. She left Israel for good, disgusted with her own people last December, but the damage to her health had apparently already been done.6

March 24, 2007
lovepeace: ...
A sick war getting sicker.Despicable and mind boggling.7

March 24, 2007
Dante: ...
Circumstances don't make people --- they REVEAL THEM.8

March 24, 2007
unity: support your tropps
totaly sick

and deaf dumb and blind americans wonder why the world hates them

these sicko's will come home, totaly devoid of soul, totaly addicted to killing and totly devoid of whatever it was that made us humane - and this is what supporting your troops are all about - these 'men' cold bloded killers disquised as soilders were somebodies son. shameful shameful - and the murdered, nameless faceless demonised people were someone esle father, son, brother uncle or cousin, shot by illegal invaders - shame on you amrica shame 9

March 24, 2007
Dante: Hopefully
they won't come home, or if they do they'll be too dumbed down to even put a pair of boots and step outside. This is the history of the world, from year one and even before people have been killing each other and committing harrowing acts on those earmarked for them as the enemy.
It's not as if the U.S. invented wars and invasions, they're just as brutal as the Romans once were, only less skilled.10

March 24, 2007
lizbitchwitch: What a pathetic display
Truley disgusting! And this is hardly the first one of these sort of films I have seen either. And how lovely they thought they should film it too - to put in their little book of memories! Pathetic - truley pathetic. 11

March 24, 2007
johnhatch: Monstrosity
What a monstrous and evil nation America has become, or perhaps always was. Support the troops? No, put the dumb and demented criminals on trial, and the asshole 'commander-in-chief' also. I grieve for innocent Iraqi dead. There are no innocent Americans, just vicious and crazy ones. I no longer care about American deaths. If I were there, I would do the same as patriotic Iraqis. They have every right.12

March 24, 2007
worldist: State and corporate sponsored Insanity with a view to profit through mass slaughter by mental zombies.
It is gut wrenching to watch the madness unfold with glee by uniformed cowards safely protected behind concrete walls and a strategic high ground. If an equalizing force showed in the distance the cowards would flee in terror. They and their fly boy war crime buddies loaded with DU and phosphorus weapons to use on innocent Iraqi's going about their daily business or feebly trying to defend their homeland from murderous intruders are targeted with impunity. This type of inhuman activity was what the Nuremberg trials of Germany was about. They should all be hanged and all those responsible for putting them there.

Meanwhile let's get on with bringing about a sane and just world society for ALL humanity. Go to; worldsocialism.org13

March 24, 2007
tsullivan: WIth an army made up of moron jarheads...
with a collective IQ no greater than that of an amoeba, what more can you expect? These thugs live by the sword, and they should die by the sword - they deserve nothing better.14

March 24, 2007
tsullivan: Worldist #13
Meanwhile let's get on with bringing about a sane and just world society for ALL humanity. Go to; worldsocialism.org


I still haven't found anything on your site as to HOW this sane and just world society will come about. There's a little about what it will be like, more about what it won't be like, but NOTHING WHATSOEVER concerning how it will brought to fruition.15

March 24, 2007
free expression: War is hell
This shouldn't be shocking to anyone by this point -- even if you've only seen an honest war film like Kubrick's Full Metal Jacket. No, obviously I'm not defending this, and yes, it's disgusting. Kubrick's film is apt, because, if the voices off camera can be believed, there was a "sniper round" that hit, I assume, before this shooting spree. The overwhelming force of the response, including, it seems, people who had nothing to do with the sniper fire, is how you win the battle and lose the war. Yes, this war is pointless (more than most), and we never should have been there. This is what happens, and we're doing it, stupidly, and for nothing.

What happens when these kids get back here? Another OKC?

We need to cut off funds for this insane war.16

March 24, 2007
Dude: ...
The video basically showed, cowardice in action and it's celebration.

The results of such action, always tragic.

One immediate, the other, more delayed.17

March 24, 2007
Dude: ...
"Circumstances don't make people --- they REVEAL THEM.8"

Agree 100%.

18

March 24, 2007
kla: no peace time - no draft - just a turkey shoot "war" - really mean weapons – Goliath wins this one
People (thugs) are signing up while there exists (a rarity) neither peace-time nor a draft; thus killing is known to be available if not inevitable, and from a safe distance.

In any collection of humans, there is a fringe with a true warrior mentality, it seems. Perhaps a bit like the SS that went into the Ukraine and hanged people for no apparent reason, other than to set an example.
19

March 24, 2007
Legolas_Greenleaf: Let's keep all these videos archived and documented
One day we will win and all these war criminals will be hanged.

Those two cars that entered into frame after 45 seconds were obviously not part of whatever was going on beforehand, they were target practice. This is (as usual) cut and dried war crimes. They're monsters and they need to die.

One day the US is going to attack the wrong country and the 300 to 1 casualty rate is going to be reversed.20

March 24, 2007
worldist: RE: #15 tsullivan: Worldist #13
I still haven't found anything on your site as to HOW this sane and just world society will come about. There's a little about what it will be like, more about what it won't be like, but NOTHING WHATSOEVER concerning how it will brought to fruition.15


Because Socialism is based on democratic order, it cannot be forced on people. Its necessary that an immense majority become clearly aware of the problem of retaining Capitalism and in so doing the alternative solution will clearly reveal itself. The working-class must organise and strive to abolish Capitalism and implement socialism themselves.

Because Capitalism is a dynamic destructive and progressive system we cannot predict at what point sufficient numbers of people will rise to the occasion and establish socialism. We cannot provide much insight as to the details of the Socialist society that will be democratically established at that time. It would be predicated on being able to predict the future and what those people engaged in the democratic process would be deciding what's best for themselves at that time.

Yes, we will be ridding ourselves of much of the destructive waste of energy expended that's required and demanded by Capitalism both human and natural. So much so that it will enable humans to sustainably live comfortably in a relaxed and constructive environment. Establishing Socialism will include eliminating the whole banking and money system including the military, courts, jails and monetary system. A tremendous amount of commuting locally and around the world will no longer be necessary. Producing goods locally will likely be encouraged to reduce unnecessary shipping and handling.

The more one researches the economics of Capitalism the more one realizes just how extremely destructive and wasteful it really is. Leading us to insurmountable problems that cannot be solved within the constraints of Capitalism. That has long served its use to humanity bringing about an industrially advanced age with technical achievements lately undreamed of in the past. But its destructive nature will bury humanity unless we make the effort and succeed in gaining rational democratic control of our destiny. Go to; www.worldsocialism.org21

March 24, 2007
tsullivan: Worldist #21
Because Socialism is based on democratic order, it cannot be forced on people. Its necessary that an immense majority become clearly aware of the problem of retaining Capitalism and in so doing the alternative solution will clearly reveal itself. The working-class must organise and strive to abolish Capitalism and implement socialism themselves.


More of the same old rhetoric. The working class must organise? The working class are far too busy trying to put food on the table and maintain a roof over their heads to 'organise'. Even if they were to organise, this 'let it happen' method of bringing about socialism is doomed to failure, because it assumes uniform motivations, desires and thoughts on the part of every member of the aforementioned 'working class' - right down to the abandonment of religious belief.


Because Capitalism is a dynamic destructive and progressive system we cannot predict at what point sufficient numbers of people will rise to the occasion and establish socialism.


Nor can you be sure that what arises in place of capitalism would be what you would consider socialism. Particularly as you don't have any plan of action to ensure that socialism is seen as the natural successor.


We cannot provide much insight as to the details of the Socialist society that will be democratically established at that time.


If, in essence, you have nothing concrete to say, then what on earth is the point of your World Socialist website and the endless advertising for the site?


It would be predicated on being able to predict the future and what those people engaged in the democratic process would be deciding what's best for themselves at that time.


Leaving it to chance (which is effectively what you are saying) will mean that the likelihood of socialism (as you see it) emerging as the new 'system' is as close as is possible to zero.


Yes, we will be ridding ourselves of much of the destructive waste of energy expended that's required and demanded by Capitalism both human and natural.


If you can't predict the future (and I have to admit, neither can I... yet) then how do you know that we will be ridding ourselves of anything of the sort?


So much so that it will enable humans to sustainably live comfortably in a relaxed and constructive environment. Establishing Socialism will include eliminating the whole banking and money system


And replacing it with? Barter? Community Currency? What?


including the military, courts, jails and monetary system.


Again, what will fill the void? Is that to be left to chance as well?


A tremendous amount of commuting locally and around the world will no longer be necessary.


Because it will just happen that way, or because?


Producing goods locally will likely be encouraged to reduce unnecessary shipping and handling.


"will likely"? You couldn't be more non-committal if you wanted to be.


The more one researches the economics of Capitalism the more one realizes just how extremely destructive and wasteful it really is.


For once, I can't argue with that statement.


That has long served its use to humanity bringing about an industrially advanced age with technical achievements lately undreamed of in the past. But its destructive nature will bury humanity unless we make the effort and succeed in gaining rational democratic control of our destiny.


With no blueprint, with no driving force NOTHING will happen.


Go to; [url=www.worldsocialism.org
]www.worldsocialism.org

And come away knowing just about as much as you did before you went there.22

March 24, 2007
greenIs: greenIs
American racism and genocide at its best. Killing defenseless people is fun for them. Iraqis were/are no threat to America. Are these Bush goons totally without a conscience? No wonder they painted insults on the bombs they dropped on sleeping families during "Shock & Awe." If not cheering massacres like this is "unpatriotic," then I guess I'm unpatriotic. I've heard that half or over half of the Iraqi population are children under 15. These are the victims of the war criminal sociopaths/psychopaths. God, gods, the superior being, or whatever it is that created us, values each Iraqi as much as Americans -- believe it or not (I know that's a concept that is difficult for Americans to grasp). Heroes? That's what they're treated as. What monsters. 23

March 24, 2007
Dante: ...
If you grew up playing violent video games and watching stupid yet very violent movies you'll cheer when you see this crap. I do hope those bastards get killed before they leave Iraq. 24

March 24, 2007
kla: Capitalisim - tsullivan
So the opposite of Capitalism is Socialism, as we understand Worldlist? No connection. Preaching socialism completely disregards the fact that the proposed system is to apply to humans and not ants or antelope, and even they have a heirarchy. Humans are not robots, right? Well, so far.

Dante - have you changed your tone since the Cindy article?25

March 24, 2007
paloentucu1: ...
It's the rule rather than the exception....Fucking murderers!!!!26

March 24, 2007
paloentucu1: ...
" NO unarmed people were hurt during the shooting "

" yeah bitch , you are fucking gone.."..."we fucked those people all to hell"

Cowards, stomach turning cowards what a bunch of "brave" fucking murderers !!!!... I say.27

March 24, 2007
hareli: This video needs to be Digg'd, Huffit'd, spread ALL OVER THE WEB
This video needs to be Digg'd, Huffit'd, spread ALL OVER THE WEB. This video needs the widest distribution. Enough! Support the Troops? F**k 'em. This is cold-blooded murder, and permission for this behavior comes from the highest levels in the DoD and Pentagon. These troops need to comes home NOW.28

March 24, 2007
kla: hareli - sure you want them home ?- well, will be needing Halliiburton camp guards (Blackwater contract).
At least in the US civil war, they were fair game on either side across the meadow, same weapons. This is the new sick society. "Civilized" has been sliding downhill for a 100 years.

But it has everything to do the ones (sponsors) that create the atmosphere for which this is consistent. It always comes down to leadership when sheep are involved.29

March 24, 2007
Angel Gabriel: Picking wings off flies
is an early childhood sign of a Sociopathic personality. Dumping employees with 15 years of faithful unblemished service to cut costs and increase profits for the short term budget and stocxkholders interest is the sign of a Corporate Sociopathic personality. Stay the course in an illegal and immoral War against an innocent and weaker opponnent is an Empirical Sociopathic policy.
Remaining silent and not forcing a halt to the mayhem, murder, rape pillaging and burning, child molestation, unflinching cold blooded team assault on Iraqi's, Palestinian's, Lebanese, or any other human being is the pinnacle of mass Societal Sociopathic behaviour.
How do you teach a Sociopath not to be a Sociopath? Isolation? If the rest of the world would hit the Sociopath's in the purse it would stop them in their tracks! Wouldn't it?
Freeze all U.S. funds in International banks, boycott ALL U.S. made products, don't fly on US made Boeing planes, don't buy US made Cars, don't use your VISA Am-Ex, Master Card, break your oil supply contracts and don't sell them oil. Starve the bastards to their knees. Isolate. 30

March 24, 2007
Angel Gabriel: If Move-on.org
is so cozy with Peolosi, maybe someone there would send her a link to this video so it might be shown in Congress. After all, supporting your troops is seeing them in action right?!!

Let them be shown their troops!31

March 24, 2007
Kahoneez: Racist clowns go home.
THEY are racist, cowardly murderers and hopefully they don't run over an IED and get blown up, because I would hate to see their brains spilled all over the beautiful soil of a once sovereign country, before being invaded by Imperialistic, racist, murdering filth.
COWARDS. 32

March 24, 2007
Romira: Romira
These are the wonderful heroic American troops that all the war criminal politions in Washington want to support. God bless them and their humanitarian work in Iraq.. NOT!!. :((33

March 24, 2007
wlh1us: civilians mabey, armed probably, shot dead forsure
war is hell, look what this gov started, back in my day vietnam vets were thought of the same way, just wait till these soldiers come back here with attitudes, im sure they all just love our commander in cheif and love the extended tours they have to live with, and the deaths of their fellow soldiers, and the visions of the sights they have to see everyday..... 34

March 25, 2007
wlh1us: hell will be overflowing
look at the way monsters play35

March 25, 2007
50GOODONES: "Video Shows U.S. Soldiers killing Iraqi Civilians"
U.S. Troops That have lost The war, any war by killing any civilians and living behind, presents and futures of The Looser Warcrimes. Lt. Kelly did it in Viet-Nam and , Etc.

Let me get it straight for those that are afraid of a minority of War criminals although This Video has to be investigated by Intelligence.

Since Viet-Nam, I was there and Thanks to God I did not have to shoot my M-16 Rifle at anyone. I was assign 3 different Cities to Exchange repai parts and although dusters patrolled some spots in The Roads, no one ever Shot any of Us, But off course that they shot us with motors at The compound and may have killed one of Us, also The Viet-Cong blew up one of our Amo-Dumps like a Volcano that wants to meet with The Sun about a mile off our compound and killed several of our Viet-Namese Soldiers. (declassified) The Amo-Dump blew for 7 days and nights slowly winding down.

Any way do not be afraid of War criminals, Those that get away with murder are ussually counselled and suffer the rest of their life from Trauma.

Also do not be afraid of War criminals because there are more of Us than there are of Them. They can not kill us all so they have to Hide and compromise.

Since Viet-Nam there have been several graduations at West Point and other Armed forces institutions. There are millions and millions of Us that condem war crimes.

Our code of Conduct, War Rules of Engagement, Trades of Leadership never teach us to loose The War by killing The Innocent. That includes suspects and all civilians and especially Women and Children.

I have herd of poison minds by War drugs and Savege War crimes like "The ICH Video". But thank God i have never had to witness them. The Viet-Cong were The Worse ever at killing, Raping, intimidating and living behind the Pol-Pot Campuchia (Cambodia experience). Hundreds of Millions have been killed in The last 100 years of imperfect and disbalanced fulfillment of Prophecy, Hope that The near future brings a more peacefull co-existing future.

Thank you for your time and I hope Washington, D.C., of YHWH gets a hold of my comments and act against any and all war criminals. Then again I do not beleive that 4 generals and 9 officers conspired to assessinate the Young football player, butsome deranged ally surely did.
If we were to search The truth about The 4 generals and most of those officers, The Mind reading computer of the future would probably find them not guilty of conspiracy against The Youg football player HERO. My Condolenses to all that loved Him and May our Mighty GOG have Him In His (GOD's) GLORY> Mt.17:1-8, GOD's Children never Die and are in every place and never ending.

See you and thanks for the chance to comment.

'One World Nation Under God, but First Prophecy'.
We need to press towards world peace and make The World better off by eliminating World Ghetto and Wars. We Need Rich Nations and Well OFF Persons co-existing in peace. We must press to cahnge world constitutions as we roll in prophecy so we can preach and teach The kingdoms of our GOD to The great harvest of The World, if not they will be raptured less educated and ignorant to my words, if they never here of God's Dreams $ Visions of revelations for a Perfected Earth Millennium Under Christ Jesus. Webster dictionary. Millenium: A spand of a thousand years under the Rule of The Greatest Angel, Man human God Angel taht have ever exposed The life forms that are loose upon our earth universe.
WE MUST CHANGE THE CONSTITUTIONS THROUGH OUR PRESIDENTS< CONGRESS< SENATE< SUPREME COURTS< ETC., But beginning with ourselfs by becoming a walking rock church filled with knowledge and truth. Matthew 5:18, Matthew 24:14, Matthew 28:16-20, Revelation 1:1-5-7. 2 Tim. 3:16,17, John 8:32.

Rapture is near, just as soon as Prophecy fills The moment or Ends The Events.
Mt.24:26-33. Denie GOD and you denie your self (equivalent of starving to death)....

50 GOODONES....
March 24th, 2007 Saturday 8:34 P.M. EST.

P.S. The Government of France have declssified 100,000 thousand New UFO documents (historic)
GO TO http://www.cnes.fr, If you give search a chance, you will find an English selection.36

March 25, 2007
Ironhead: The Few The Proud, The Marines..." Bad Boys, Bad Boys, Whatch Gonna Do When They Come For You
Yes, then they will be awarded medals for their uncommon valor and heroism, exhibiting the raw courage to kill unarmed civilians, oops I meant 'insurgents'.

"When you got 'em by the balls, hearts and minds will follow..."

Ah, the Power, the Glory...The American Way, "Peace through superior firepower" (over an un-armed 'enemy').

Air superiority (over a country without an airforce!)

Full Spectrum Dominance.

"Here, Bitch, take that!"

Great stories for the children, feel the Pride, show 'em your medals of honor...

Then one day, many years later they found him hanging from a tree...jumped off a ladder.

...to the Proud, the Brave... by your acts of uncommon cowardice and callous disregard for the principles of Humanity, the Geneva Conventions, and the Uniform Code of Military Justice, you have SPIT ON THE SACRIFICES OF THOSE WHO GAVE THEIR LIVES IN WWII TO END FASCISM. WWII WAS FOUGHT TO STOP ILLEGAL INVASIONS AND UNLAWFUL OCCUPATIONS AND TO FREE THOSE COUNTRIES OCCUPIED.

Your day will come. 37

March 25, 2007
50GOODONES: "VIDEO SHOWS U.S. SOLDIERS KILLING UNARMED IRAQI CIVILIANS"
I do Apologize for mispelled words.
50 GOOD ONES: Should read, GOD and not GOG. although we co-exist with Gog, but as they come of age, they may awaken to GOD ALL MIGHTY. We either co-exist or perish.

I am a Dav*" Psalm 33:12, Revelation 5:5, "I Shall Return To Be Seen".
"In God We Trust", "*GOD IS....LOVE, MAGICAL, ETC..*".
RRR. (*"DAV*") Disabled American Veterans.
Peace Thru Strenth, Trade, Truth and The Persuit of happines.

GOD brings The Rains for The Good and The Bad should learn to also be thankfull and heal from The wounds of imperfection. By The way it is raining here in Hialeah 6:00 P.M. Rains and gentle winds.

Any comments for me, please treat me as I would treat you. LIFESAVERS.

38

March 25, 2007
PC Fong: Hard day at the local store! Buying groceries was never so risky in the "f$#%!n'" USA!!!
I've blogged this at http://pc-fong.spaces.live.com with an approximate transcript:-

"'You beaut! ....get that f....r off! (rocket grenade) ......I let that f....r off, dude ......he got thirty rounds!" "Cease fire, cease fire!" "Waa-hoooo!" "...(Laughing) ...we f....d those people ......all that shit down there!....." "I shot that dude in the white car ......and he ran into the f....n' building! ....... "You see those two people .....I f.....g ripped them!" (Laughing)...more, more ......did you get that on recorder - or what?"
39

March 25, 2007
PC Fong: So much for the "Iwo Jima" company of US 1/5 Marines!
The courage and sense of duty of their fellow Marines on Iwo Jima breathes dignity into their own acts, even 55 years down the road........." http://www.geocities.com/sniper1_5/IwoJima.html

Letters from Iwo Jima (2006) "...The main characters all have an interesting story to tell. But in the end the message is clear. War is futile..." http://iwojimathemovie.warnerbros.com/lettersofiwojima/framework/framework.html

Quote from 1/5 Marines website(?): ....The Vietnam War was not a Movie. It was not a 'Conflict'. It was not a game or a form of entertainment. Vietnam was a war. Real men fought it, real men bled and real men died in it. This site is to Honor those men...... http://www.geocities.com/sniper1_5/Notice.html - http://www.usmclinks.com/ - http://www.geocities.com/sniper1_5/
1st Battalion 5th Marines (1/5) is an infantry battalion in the United States Marine Corps based out of Camp Pendleton, California consisting of approximately 800 Marines and Sailors. They fall under the command of the 5th Marine Regiment and the 1st Marine Division. http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/agency/usmc/1-5.htm

40

March 25, 2007
gakabani: ...
Americans are today what Germans were during Nazi Germany. The so called army of the US has become simply a mercenary army for the oil industry.
What you see here is the essence of the so called US army. Do you think anyone cares in the USA? I think not. They are sleeping. 41

March 25, 2007
PC Fong: An exciting day at the office......killing "gooks"
Some more of the "glorious history" of the 1/5 Marines http://www.vietnamheroes.com/photoalbums.htm42

March 25, 2007
Dante: KLA
No I haven't changed my tone KLA, I understand the causes and the reasons, but I don't look forward to having those creeps driving around here or carrying guns, coming to my house to repair something, or just having them around at all. How is anyone who behaves like those beasts going to settle down into an ordinary life once they come back to the U.S.? Isn't enough crime around here as it is? So what can we expect when the boys return home? 43

March 25, 2007
cat48: Why I don't support them
As I was driving out of town today about 6 military vehicles passed the opposite way.
They were all suited up. I felt like flipping them off. If I had seen this earlier
today I probably would have. (Plus, I can't figure out why they were out here in nowhere
land).44

March 25, 2007
Fatima: now i know , stupid is as stupid does.
people wonder why other countrys hate usa, just look at the video, and you will understand.
Those men think they can kill, people cause they wear a unform, NOT.THSES MAN IF YOU CAN CALL THEM THAT ACT LIKE LITTLE BOYS PLAYING WAR
45

March 25, 2007
NguyenKha: Simply Animals! The GIs are simply animals.
Every where They come they do the same thing. They murder innocent people like playing sport.
Like playing PC games. They are just animals.
They did the same thing in My Lai Viet Nam. They do the same thing again now in Iraq.
And they all laugh.
Yeah.. They still claim they are decent people.. decent my ass!!!
Such thick face.. They all have thick face.
Sicked. They are sicked. America is a sicked country.
The land of criminals, terrorists and hypocrites.period.

Nguyen Kha

46

March 25, 2007
ChavezResistance: Pass this on!
If every one of you on this board who is disgusted with this passes the link to this on - it will get known. Target middle America put the link on boards about sport, driving SUVs, whatever, SOME people there will have a conscience, and if we can enlighten some then it is a job well done, those Iraqi people slaughtered for these boy's amusement may not have died in vain. Do it now - find a message boarsd somewhere and post the link, then do it again every day for the rest of the week. Channel your rage into action. 47

March 25, 2007
buthaina: American Heroes
These are the heroes that American People support !! You may have noticed that the US killers are standing on a roof of an ordinary Iraqi house. I wonder what happened to the people of that house before your killers could seize the roof.48

March 25, 2007
buthaina: Your terrorists
When these US terrorists (what do you call those who travel thousands of miles to other countries to kill innocent people whom they even do not know, just for the kick of killing and because they are hired for this duty by the peopele-elected US government)come home dead, they will be called "fallen heroes" and they will be wrapped in US flag which will be presented to the greived family in a solemn ceremony. Moreover, this assassin people-elected government passed a law where anyone who does not support the killing would be considered unpatriotic! So American patriots go on support your terrorists.49

March 25, 2007
jerrygates7: jerry gates ; Get thes guys out of there, now
Tom Feely contributes this film of United States soldiers killing a man in cold blood as he attempts to flee "turkey shooters" picking off civilians from behind a concrete wall.

Tom Feely wants this film distributed among the websites participating in the anti-war movement as proof positive of what the United States is funding in Iraq by the passage of a bill that contributes over 100 billion dollars to pay the salaries of these soldiers who have become addicted to murder. We , as citizens of the United States, are paying these murderers to enjoy killing innocent ,unarmed civilians. The weight of this shame is crushing any resolve among war opponents to refrain from violence in mitigating this heinous crime against humanity.

Nothing has worked in the anti-war community's efforts to stem the flow of innocent blood in the streets of Iraq. We call for restraint and negotiation, they vote to fund the slaughter of Iraqi citizens by diseased, reprobate minded lunatics. This is the State of The Nation, and a more dire straight there has never been.

"This war will be fought for 20, 30 or 40 years" are the words of the late Dick Cheney. Before his passing ,Dick Cheney distinguished himself as being an advocate of protracted warfare in Afghanistan, Iraq, Pakistan, Lebanon, and Syria as a tool of subjugating the planet to the death squads of United States mercinary forces and the back seated U.S. military. Cheney's legacy is one of false pride, false religion , and falsehood for profit. Lies, lies, lies will be the title of the biography of this war mongering capitalist. Whatever good he has done in behalf of his nation will be overshadowed by his complicity in the erasure of human rights and his disrepect for human life in his inexorable march for United States hedgmony in the world.

Tom Feely , by now, has seen as much war and lies as any man can stand. A war initiated in deciet , perpetuated in cowardice, prosecuted in insanity ,and fought tooth and nail by every peaceful mind on the planet has created a breach in the government of the United States through which a 757 jetliner can fly .

Escape to foriegn soil and hiding behind well paid mercinaries is the fate of those who have manufactured the war in Iraq,produced it's products, and reaped huge profits for their constituents . What care have they for the United States , they will be long gone as the mother of all blowbacks hits the fans of the planet and returns to the shores of the the United States
as the regurgitated blood of a sucking chest wound, inflicted as a malicious and evil intentioned bid for supremacy.

What healing and forgiveness can occur if war is perpetuated by those unable to summon reason and wisdom? Wherein can compassion and love work their miracle if no place is given them as tools of peace? Who will lead the march of peace if all who are for peace are labeled as heretics and enemies of the United States and Isreal?Why have fear and greed replaced charity and faith in the once fortuitous House of representatives. When will the voice of the American people rise above the special interests of armaments contractors and AIPAC lobbiests?

The above questions need answers, not irresponsible side stepping and half truths if confidence in the United States population and their government is to be restored in the world community. It must be recognised that this disastrous course of violent overthrow of a nation will leave the United States weakened to the point of collapse and contribute to economic instability with no friends to turn to. Who would bail out a violent and selfish pair such as the United States and Isreal if a calamity would strike and leave us weak?

Tom Feely's "witness To A War Crime" is a frank indightment of the prosecutors of the war in Iraq as cold blooded assasins of a nation and it's people for no other reason than to enslave the population of this country in the name of the very same democracy which so agregiously fails the nation from which it hails.

50

March 25, 2007
kla: new defintions needed:
elite=perverted slobs, war=turkey shoot, partisanen=insurgents, soldiers=thugs, patriot=idiot, security=scam, heroic=con, honor=long gone.

Stronger words needed: atrocities plus, hideous plus.

Jerry Gates - You focus is on Iraq. Is Afghanistan in principle any different? Two years older. Started on same type of lies. Both about oil business. Neither is a war, would you not agree? If the "bad guys" are any bader, is it only due to good propaganda?51

March 25, 2007
DJ Dazzy D: The soldier "Doc" posted this video at Live Leek and left comments about it.
Go to http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=b83_1173818870 Look for comments by Tyer82 the video poster. It was 1st posted on March 13.

I will repost 4 of his comments below.

I shot the video! The white car had 4-5 males with 3 AK's and 1 RPG left on the floor board. The other cars were trying to make their way up the street to the house at the end so they could become a get away car. We had proir knowledge of their arrival from a relay from the "eye in the sky". Notice how no chicks, kids or spectators are there! So get fucked you hajji lover.

If you look at who posted the video and my name they are the same. It was Aug 22 2005. I was there, I was the Corpsman who video taped it. Also when we went to the parket after the fight there were 3 males I shot 2 alive and I refused to treat them. I also Shot the male in the white durka durka in the street. The whole video is about 25-35 minutes long, it shows all the "clean up" part and our brass checking to ensure we didnt do anything illegal. So I tried to place the good parts in. And the yelling is cause we are having a good time. Killing "bad guys" is fucking awsome, what a reward to look through your ACOG and see your rounds impact flesh. Fuck yeah!

Well I do feel like dork for arguing on the "interweb" but I do feel great. I like shooting people. But fuck I didnt know that until I went there and did it. Last I checked the radical muslims started this fucked up game of tag. Dont be pissed if we hit harder.

yes yes yes, im a huge pos. dont care, i know what I did and thats all that matters. I dont give two shits about any other country than the US. If we have to walk over radical muslims to get what we need, so be it. And I must have been hallucinating cause the fuckin middle east was a shit hole way before we got to it. You turds cant even stop fighting between tribes. Holy shit, its like two different church's fightin about who loves god more. Maybe stopping and figuring a way to make a sewer system and potable water could be higher up on the plans, but dont worry America and its allies will do that for ya too. Oh yeah Skunt tag yer it bitch.52

March 25, 2007
yawarbaig: So what's next??
The video is a cause even for despair. The comments are a sign of hope. I am not American. But I can say that when there is a nation where people are willing to criticize what needs to be criticized, then there is still hope. The big question of course is about making this happen. Stopping this ridiculous war. As long as the feeling remains in these comments and does not hit the street and polling booths, nothing will happen. I was listening to Obama's speech at AIPAC and had great trouble keeping the bile down. His opponent is not much better. If either of them is the future successor of the vegetable who is currently in the house on the hill, there is not much hope as I can see. As long as America remains enslaved to the agenda of others, it will continue to do totally stupid things like the war on Iraq. Or the even more dumb war on Iran that is being planned. Tell me when will it be that Americans start thinking for and about America and stop sacrificing themselves, their money, their good name and their honor (the word still exists, you know!!) for the sake of propping up a totally deranged, demented and despicable regime. As the old proverb says, "A man is known by the friends he keeps." America is known by its friends, all of whom seem to be dictators, oppressors and gangsters. The choice is yours........you, the ordinary American. Do you choose to pretend to be powerless and restrict your anger to the internet? Or do you have the courage to accept your power and the responsibility that goes with it and show the world that you have it in you to be true leaders to the world? Which one??53

March 25, 2007
DJ Dazzy D: Link with comments
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=b83_1173818870&c=154

March 25, 2007
lizbitchwitch: Kla
"People (thugs) are signing up while there exists (a rarity) neither peace-time nor a draft; thus killing is known to be available if not inevitable, and from a safe distance."

That was the mistake the government made during the vietnam war - they instituted a draft which caused an uprising. Typical ameircans - unconcerned with wars unless they get the call to go to one - or unless they like doing the killing - then they volunteer.

55

March 25, 2007
PC Fong: To "DJ Dazzy D" - re Link with comments......
"...DJ Dazzy D: The soldier "Doc" posted this video at Live Leek and left comments about it.
Go to http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=b83_1173818870 Look for comments by Tyer82 the video poster. It was 1st posted on March 13...."

Thanks, DJ. I saw comments posted by " Tyer82 " at pp. 2,3,4,5,6,12,13,14,15,16,17,20.

Of all his tripe, at leat he admitted that 1/5 Marines record was worse in Vietnam (my older Vietnamese friends called it "the American war"! - see my earlier link re pics). It seems that they understand words like "massacre" and "atrocity" but are in complete denial about themselves and their own actions!?!?

Also see
Falluja massacre Added: Nov 23 2006 In: News By: ssemino http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=39479c5aff and The US Army's 2/3 FA colts battle insurgents in Adhamiwa, Iraq. Added: Mar 24 2007 In: News By: Dronetek http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=75e_1174792380


56

March 25, 2007
almaentity: AWOL is the only support from me.
I don't support the troops. They are murderers. I support the troops who refuse to be murderers. I do NOT support the troops who "do their jobs". PERIOD!57

March 26, 2007
peggy for peace: Horrifying....
This video sickened me. What kind of monsters have we created? We invade a sovereign nation and then do what we can to destroy it, believing that the people who live there and are trying to protect their homes and neighborhoods deserve to be wiped off the earth?! We must support people like Lt Ehren Watada and others who understand that what is happening in our natme is illegal and immoral. What will these soldiers be like when they return home? Will we be reading about them going berserk, as we read about Vietnam vets? I think it is highly likely. The ones who have a soul and conscience are sometimes turning to suicide... What a mess Georgie has brought about.58

March 26, 2007
Zipperhead67: Smile when you hear a 'BOOM!'
that will be the sound of another American losing some limbs for King George and Prince Dick. What's the total now? 20,000? 30,000 amputees out of the 50,000 wounded? I feel all Iraqis are entitled to attack US troops, that is the right of an indigenous peoples to repel foreign invaders. So they planted IEDs? Nothing wrong with that at all in my book as long as their target was military.

Tyer82 would do well to remember that he is a foreign invader in a soveriegn nation

The US unfortunately is very good at killing people who defend their countries, whilst managing to lose the war anyway!59

March 26, 2007
zelda253: What should I tell them?
I submitted this video to gather.com and I got back comments that they were fending off a sniper, (supposedly mentioned at beginning) and the cars were probably full of reinfocements. How can I prove to them that they were shooting at civilians?

http://www.gather.com/viewArticle.jsp?articleId=28147497694006760

March 26, 2007
NguyenKha: They already did right inside the USA!!!
GreyRaven: The American pantywaiste culture !!!

Thay already did right inside their own society.
Sean Bell- NY was shot, Nguyen Thi Bich Cau, San Jose,CA was shot...

Yes, indeed, The American pantywaiste culture

Nguyen Kha
61

March 26, 2007
worldist: ..RE: zelda253: What should I tell them?
The US military, mercenaries and their accomplices are the invading armed intruders in Iraq committing war crimes and genocide against the people of Iraq. The Iraqi's are innocent of any wrong doing and are fully and legally entitled to carry whatever weapons they can get their hands on to defend their people, homeland and the resources of Iraq from brutal ignorant international thugs. They are innocent victims, the only ones entitled to carry weapons and kill intruders. Just imagine some gun wielding retarded thugs coming into your home intent on stealing your valuables and killing you if you resist. Wouldn't you and friends be entitled to use deadly force against them? Of course you would be so entitled as would your friends and the police if available. Koffe Anon of the UN clearly stated the invasion was illegal and according to the Nuremberg trials of WWII its the worst war crime of all. The perpetrators and their superiors should all hang!62

March 26, 2007
worldist: RE #22 tsullivan: Worldist #21
Because the general interpretation commonly understood about socialism made no sense to me from the time I was about 14 years old I tried to find out exactly what it was. It wasn't until I was about 30 years old and after having gained considerable experience and knowledge about the world that fortunately by chance I happened across it. To make it easier for others I post the link for their information.

I leave the link to the website of the World Socialist Movement for those who sincerely are interested in learning first hand about Socialism from Socialists that have maintained their sound scientific analysis of Capitalist society and the solution to the problems facing humanity worldwide. The Socialist Party and its Companion parties initially formed in 1904 and the founding members in England of which discussed socialism in depth with Karl Marx before he died and was buried in England. Because it does take considerable effort on the part of the student to learn the main connecting specialties of science to get a sound understanding of evolution. So too does it require an in-depth view and research of society and economics to gain an understanding of Socialism's analysis of Capitalism from a materialist perspective. This discussion board is not suited to the needs of full debate on the subject to do it justice. Nor have I the time to spend going over all the different facets when there is a whole history of periodicals available free, on-line and people willing to carry on reasonable critical debate on any aspect of the subject that you want cleared up at the site, I most always post a link to. www.worldsocialism.org63

March 26, 2007
lordterror: ...
Does it appear that civilians were killed? Maybe. The film doesn't show what caused the soldier to start firing in the first place. And as to the fact that they seem to be enjoying killing, who wouldn't be proud of a job well done. that's what a soldier is there to do, kill people. soldiers are not policemen, and they shouldn't be judged as if they are. thats why we have a police force to protect the civilian populace and not soldiers. They carry bigger gun, not to mentgion explosives. When soldiers go in to an area it to kill, either by attacking or by defending. either way the result is the same. People die on both sides. one last thought, if you live in a war zone you have to be aware of you surroundings. driving thru a fiire fight is not a wise thing to do.64

March 26, 2007
kla: lizbitchwitch: draft
Exactly right. The scam for this one is even much better understood (than Vietnam). A draft would cause an explosion of mothers and draft-age people. Is it not a shame that it has to take such an incentive?65

March 26, 2007
kla: I sort of wonder what America would think if this had taken place in downtown L.A.
Probably wouldn't care. Just a bunch of "minorities" having it out.

Might cause a stir in Buffalo, NY, or such.66

March 26, 2007
Not_An_American: @lordterror
The articles of engagement specifcally state that targeting of civilians is a war crime...if there is no further incoming, there is no reason to continue outgoing fire...troops who continue to send outgoing have lost their fire discipline, not that the US forces ever had much to begin with.

I can only hope that one day a foreign power inflicts a similar series of circumstances on you personally so that you can experience it all first hand from the Iraqi viewpoint.67

March 26, 2007
PC Fong: To "kla" - Botched L.A bank heist turns into bloody shootout ; AND "zelda253" - Open crime forum
#66 - Quote kla: "...I sort of wonder what America would think if this had taken place in downtown L.A."

It did, kla, 10 years ago! http://www.cnn.com/US/9702/28/shootout.update/


#60 - Quote zelda253: "...What should I tell them...?" strange how some can filter things out if they don't want to know or hear ....partly denial and partly refusal ...... but they are denying their own humanity and refusing to accept the results of their own actions. That is, they are afraid of "the TRUTH" .....or, more to the point, they are to weak or fearful to do anything about it. I got the video posted on a national media website but it only got a single response ....the rest completely ignored it and prattled on about relatively minor or insignificant incidents http://blogs.theaustralian.news.com.au/garyhughes/index.php/theaustralian/comments/open_crime_forum1/P20/ - by comparison, you have done well!68

March 26, 2007
kla: PC Fong
"...I sort of wonder what America would think if this had taken place in downtown L.A."

was due to ARVY. My comment was that they would not care in the US and case you cite proves it.69

March 26, 2007
Dante: @Zelda 253
Haven't you been watching the news? Even the craven government controlled TV channels and press report about the many, MANY abuses the troops are committing in Iraq. Rape, murder, home invasion. Just search the past articles ICH has offered and offers almost daily. I can't believe that you can't think of anything to tell the ones playing Pollyana regarding the atrocities this government commits and has committed almost since day one, since 1772.
Let's stop playing disingenous, Ok, 'Zelda'?70

March 26, 2007
tsullivan: Worldist #63
I leave the link to the website of the World Socialist Movement for those who sincerely are interested in learning first hand about Socialism from Socialists


As I (and others) have said, there is precious little on your site to indicate what world socialism is, but lots about what it is not.


that have maintained their sound scientific analysis of Capitalist society and the solution to the problems facing humanity worldwide.


Sound scientific analysis, or psuedo-scientific analysis? Where are the empirical proofs? Given that your theory has yet to be tested for soundness, how can you make this claim?


The Socialist Party and its Companion parties initially formed in 1904 and the founding members in England of which discussed socialism in depth with Karl Marx before he died and was buried in England. Because it does take considerable effort on the part of the student to learn the main connecting specialties of science to get a sound understanding of evolution.

Sorry, Bill, but this sounds like you are just being patronising. For what it is worth, at the age of 14 I was already reading the Communist Manifesto, Socialism: Utopian and Scientific, Das Kapital and a myriad of other works by Marx or Engels - in addition to works by Hegel, Paine, John Stuart Mill and others. While I agree with much of the analysis presented by Marx and Engels, I am not so foolish as to ascribe to it either the status of religious dogma or scientific fact.


So too does it require an in-depth view and research of society and economics to gain an understanding of Socialism's analysis of Capitalism from a materialist perspective. This discussion board is not suited to the needs of full debate on the subject to do it justice. Nor have I the time to spend going over all the different facets when there is a whole history of periodicals available free, on-line and people willing to carry on reasonable critical debate on any aspect of the subject that you want cleared up

In other words, you can't answer my critique.


at the site, I most always post a link to.

Well, there's one fact I won't dispute.71

March 26, 2007
kla: Dante
Is it true, MSM reports this stuff?72

March 26, 2007
worldist: Reply to #71
Socialism is the science of understanding society from a materialist (scientific, evolutionary) perspective. To the point of recognizing the cause and effect nature of human energy expended in changing social/material conditions within one's immediate surroundings and historically worldwide. Leading to a natural solution of the problems confronting the individual and the whole of human society.

Until the working-class of the world become consciously aware of their class interests within World Capitalism and make a democratic, concerted effort by the immense majority to establish common ownership of the means and instruments of producing the needs of humanity. Organized to establish a free money-less production solely for USE free economy worldwide. Socialism/Communism (meaning the same thing) remains an idea coming of age at which point therell be no power greater. The need for it grows as each day passes and the necessary awareness of the contradictions of Capitalism become more glaring with its brutal destructive nature revealing itself.

Don't just stop at the introductory pages of the posted link, dig into it in-depth there's over a hundred years of evidence based analytical writing to consider. www.worldsocialism.org

For the constructive sanity and peace of mind within a plenty for all, sustainable worldwide democratic economy of genuine socialism.73

March 26, 2007

Using children as human shields

Gideon Levy, Haaretz, Mar 22, 2007

This article was originally published by Haaretz and is republished with permission.

Palestinian boys play in the narrow streets of the historic old city of Nablus, where recently Israeli soldiers used Palestinian children as human shields. (Amanda Nunn, IMEU)

When it was all over, the soldiers gave her a cookie and some halva. And just to be on the safe side, they added a threat: "Don't you dare tell your parents; otherwise we'll kill you," they told her before letting her go, knowing they had done a terrible thing. But little Jihan did tell, and so did her parents: The IDF is using children as human shields.

Regarding this practice, known as "early warning" or the "neighbor procedure," then Supreme Court president Aharon Barak wrote in October 2005: "These considerations lead me to the conclusion that the 'Early Warning' procedure is at odds with international law. It comes too close to the normative 'nucleus' of the forbidden, and is found in the relatively grey area of the improper. The result is that we turn the order nisi into an order absolute, in the following way: we declare that the 'Early Warning' procedure contradicts international law." Thus the practice was declared illegal, banned by the Supreme Court. But so what? Instead of using men, how about a little girl? The "neighbor procedure" is prohibited? So we'll use the "neighbor's daughter procedure."

Jihan Dadush, 11, who lived in the Nablus casbah, was rewarded with halva and a cookie after soldiers had her leave her house early one evening and lead them to the hiding place of wanted suspects, enter a dark and abandoned apartment to check if anyone was hiding there or if there were any explosive devices inside. They did the same thing with Amid Amira, a 15-year-old boy from another part of Nablus. He, too, was sent into a dark apartment, at dawn, to scout out the place himself. Arfa Amira, 12, was sent in to investigate who was in his own apartment. Instead of the famous "After me!" ethos of the IDF heritage, now we have "After her!" - a young girl led off by armed soldiers who hide behind her.

We walk through the alley-ways of the Old City of Nablus - thousand-year-old buildings whose beauty rivals those in Jerusalem's Old City - with two excellent investigators from the B'Tselem organization, Salma Dab'i and Abdel Karim Sa'adi. Two weeks after the operation, the casbah is full of people. Now is the time of the 'aqub, a plant that grows in the mountains and has a very short season. Its price is already on the rise: This week it was selling in the casbah for NIS 25 per kilo - the truffles of Nablus.

Passing stands that sell grape leaves and lamb ribs, we enter a dim stone building. In its inner courtyard, where woolen blankets are now being aired out, 14 people were killed during Operation Defensive Shield. Five years later, in Operation Warm Winter, four times soldiers have raided this winding, mysterious compound, with its narrow staircases leading off in every direction. Only the locals really know these alleyways and the passages between them. The soldiers were searching for tunnels here, but in the Old City of Nablus, one can pass from building to building via the rooftops.

Related stories Artist and professor Mary Tuma Country report on human rights practices: Israel and the occupied territories The wall: Part of the settlements What are the Occupied Territories? The Democratic Constitution (PDF)

Steep stone steps lead us to the apartment of the Dadush family - Tahni, Nimr and their four children, who live in three small, neat rooms, with arched, damp ceilings. While we wait for Jihan to return from school, her mother, Tahni, recounts her own nightmares from Operation Warm Winter. On Sunday, February 25, when the operation began, soldiers took over two of the neighboring apartments. The Hawah and Jadallah families had to crowd into one small room. And here's the punch line: When one group of soldiers burst into the Hawah family's apartment, they found another group of soldiers already there. "They were in shock when they saw other soldiers in the apartment," laughs Tahni.

A few hours later, they arrived at her home. Nine people, including in-laws and a sister, were forced to gather in this tiny living room where we are now sitting. The father, Nimr, was arrested and sent to Hawara for interrogation. He returned 14 hours later. Soon, he, too, will join our conversation, when he finishes his shift at the restaurant in the casbah where he works. Around midday, the soldiers asked to go up to the roof. In the afternoon, they left. During the night, the family was too frightened to sleep. With the IDF around the whole casbah was tense.

The next evening, around 8 P.M., they returned to the apartment, the same soldiers from the day before, and were surprised to see that Nimr had been released. This time the soldiers were carrying a lot of equipment, which frightened Tahni very much. She asked to go into the kitchen to prepare for what might be a prolonged occupation of her home, and the soldiers consented. How did they treat her? "Some were nice and some weren't." The soldiers ordered the two daughters, 15-year-old Hanan and 11-year-old Jihan, to leave the apartment. Outside, they separated the girls and asked them if they knew where the wanted men were hiding.

A pale neon light illuminates the tiny living room during the day, too. A neighbor's rooster crows. The two girls returned from the brief interrogation, straight into the arms of their frightened mother. But a little while later, a soldier came in again, looking for Jihan. He instructed the child to go outside. Tahni cried out to the soldier, "She's little, she's a little girl and she's scared," but he ignored her. Her mother was also worried because Jihan has a congenital heart defect. The soldier prevented Tahni from leaving the apartment to see what was happening to her daughter. She says she was close to fainting. She tried to phone one of the assistance organizations, like Medical Relief, for help, but was told that they couldn't come into the casbah because of the curfew.

Nimr, 36, told the soldiers: "Take me to jail or to hell, but don't touch the girl." But they pushed him away, told him to be quiet and made him stay in the room. A little while later, Tahni decided to open the door, and saw that the soldiers and Jihan were no longer near the doorway. The family's nightmare had begun.

Jihan could not tell her parents what had happened until a few days later. The soldiers, apparently along with someone from the Shin Bet who was not in uniform, had taken her outside and said that her father had told them that she knew where the wanted men were hiding. They also told the girl that her father said she knew the location of the wanted men's tunnel. She told them she had no idea about any tunnel or any apartment. They said she was lying. Jihan said the soldiers tried to bind her hands, but that she resisted and they relented. "At that moment, out of fear," says her mother, "she pointed to one of the neighbors' apartments, an apartment that has stood empty for years, and told them that that's where the people were hiding."

Three soldiers took her to the abandoned apartment she had pointed out. They ordered her to enter the dark apartment and followed, their rifles aimed at her. One of the soldiers lighted the way. Jihan pleaded with them to let her go home.

Now Hanan arrives, wearing her striped school uniform. Then Nimr comes home from work. He speaks Hebrew. Finally, Jihan arrives, too, also in her school uniform. A sixth-grader, she looks mature for her age, a cheerful, energetic girl with a long ponytail. She surprises us with her readiness to tell her story:

"The soldiers told me to come with them. One of them asked me about the tunnels and the shabab. I told them that I didn't know anything. One of them said that I was a liar. He threatened that they'd arrest me. I was scared, so I told him that there was an empty apartment, maybe the wanted men used it to sleep in. The soldiers took me to the apartment, I pointed it out to them and then they brought me back. About a half hour later, two soldiers came back and asked me to come outside. They put me in the lead and walked behind me. The soldiers pointed their rifles at me from behind. When I got to the apartment, they asked me to go inside. They used a laser beam from their rifle to light the way for me. They told me to go into the kitchen and all the rooms and then they asked me how to get up to the roof."

Jihan knew her way around the apartment. Until a few years ago, it had been the home of the Sirasi family, whose mother was a friend of her mother's. Jihan says that the soldiers spoke Hebrew to each other inside the apartment, and she didn't understand. They left her in one of the rooms and went up to the roof. The whole thing lasted about an hour and a half.

After being led out by the soldiers, she returned home at about 10 P.M. and got straight into bed, pulled the covers up over her head and didn't say a word. Her mother says that she looked very frightened. Every so often, she called out to her mother from her bed: "Have the soldiers come back for me?" In her hand were the halva and cookie the soldiers had given her. Her mother says that Jihan has recently started wetting the bed at night.

The Al-Balat quarter of Nablus, a few minutes' drive from the casbah and Jihan's house. Amid Amira, 15, woke up along with the rest of his family to the sound of a loud boom. This was at about five in the morning on February 25, the day that Operation Warm Winter started. There were seven people at home; his father was in America. A stun grenade exploded right next to the front door; the soot marks are still visible. The holes in the door, in the walls and the ceiling attest to gunfire by soldiers inside the house.

Na'ima, the mother, opened the door and was startled to see soldiers standing there. They instructed her to get everyone in the house to come outside. The whole family, which includes two babies and an 80-year-old grandmother, had to move into the neighbors' apartment, with the Quseini family. Three families were crowded in there, one family to a room. The soldiers instructed Manal, Na'ima's 17-year-old daughter, to go into their apartment, turn on all the lights, open all the windows, closets and doors. Manal didn't understand the soldiers' broken Arabic and so they took Arfa, 12, and ordered him to open all the doors and turn on all the lights for them.

In his still childlike voice, Arfa relates that one of the soldiers butted his forehead with his helmet. "My head hurt a little," the boy says. The soldiers were searching for Amer, one of the sons, and Ala, the fiance of Manal, whose brother, Omar Aqub, is on the list of wanted men. They questioned a son, Ahmed, 28, and when he told them that he had no idea where those two were, they took Amid with them.

Amid: "They said: Tell us where your brother Amer is, or we'll shoot you. I told the soldier that I didn't know, and then he hit me from behind. Then they asked me who the apartment next door belonged to and I told them that it was my uncle's. They told me to go with them to the apartment. There, they told me to go into the house, open all the doors and all the closets and turn on all the lights. They threw a smoke grenade into the house and then they told me to go in and they followed me. They spread out in all the rooms and they put me in the last room. When they didn't find anything, they led me outside." He didn't get any halva or cookies.

The IDF spokesperson responded that the incidents are under investigation.

Twilight Zone / Dress code

Your tax dollars at work.
---
Last update - 18:42 22/03/2007

By Gideon Levy

What won't the Shin Bet security service do to break the spirit of a Palestinian detainee? Before, interrogators used threats and told detainees that their loved ones were being arrested because of them. Now they even put on the show. Under false pretenses, agents brought the wife and the aged father of a security detainee to a Shin Bet interrogation facility, where they forced him to remove his kaffiyeh in order to humiliate him, then dressed him in a prisoner's uniform, held him by both arms and, through a window, displayed him to his son, who has been kept for weeks in isolation, without the opportunity to meet with a lawyer.

The result: Prisoner M. launched a hunger strike. He has attempted to kill himself in his cell three times, twice by bashing his head against the wall and once by hanging.

In its ruling prohibiting the use of torture, the High Court of Justice wrote: "A reasonable investigation is necessarily one free of torture, free of cruel, inhuman treatment of the subject and free of any degrading handling whatsoever."

The Public Committee Against Torture in Israel argued in its petition to the High Court regarding M.: "The use of the interrogation technique by which the petitioner's father and wife were presented to him as prisoners, caused and is causing the petitioner genuine psychological suffering which has led him to hurt himself and even to attempt suicide."

Justices Ayala Procaccia, Elyakim Rubinstein and Devora Berliner ruled two weeks ago on M.'s case. The High Court ordered the Shin Bet to tell M. that his wife was never arrested and to arrange for a psychiatrist to examine M. by the end of the week. In addition, it said that M.'s representatives could ask the relevant authority to review the staged imprisonment of his father to determine "the degree of legitimacy of the use of this method."

The result: In Ashkelon Prison there is a prisoner in a state of severe psychological distress, while at his home in Beit Awa his wife and father are absolutely distraught over the dirty trick played on him. The state has not permitted them to visit him since the arrest.

Psychiatrist Dr. Yaakov Elish of the Be'er Yaakov Mental Health Center, who examined the prisoner for the High Court, wrote: "In the wake of distress over imprisonment, he has developed a depressive response with tendencies to self-injury."

Beit Awa is south-west of Hebron, on the Green Line. It has 10,000 residents and two main clans. The prisoner's father, A., is from the Suwayti clan and describes himself as "nearly Israeli." For 34 years he has roamed through Israeli cities, collecting and trading in used items. Last Friday he was at a house in Ramat Gan to pick up a table and four chairs, while on Sunday, he got a call from Bat Yam, to come pick up a dining room set. In the past, A. worked for the Solel Boneh construction company, at Soroka Hospital in Be'er Sheva and for the Jewish National Fund on Kibbutz Lahav. He is 63, the father of 15, who speaks fluent Hebrew and has Israeli friends.

M., 32, is his third son. His father doesn't want the full name published because of his son's mental state. We are in M.'s home, in a living room filled with objects he chose out of his father's collecting: a dish with Hebrew text, an enormous wooden globe, an old clarinet and an old record player. It's not what you'd call a "political" living room: There is no sign of any connection with the national struggle, in contrast to most homes in the territories.

A few years ago M. opened an reupholstery shop in Beit Awa. He was arrested only once in his life, about two years ago, when he was held for six days. His wife is from the Rajoub family. They have four young children. A. says that apart from M., none of his children has ever been arrested. He is convinced that someone falsely accused his son.

At 2:30 A.M. on February 1, their world was turned upside down. M. and his wife were awakened by the sound of rocks being thrown at their door. M. went outside in his pajamas, where he was met by soldiers who told his wife to bring him a coat and shoes. M. disappeared into the night with the soldiers. For the next 30 days, no one was allowed to visit him, including his lawyer.

A week after M.'s arrest, again in the middle of the night, soldiers knocked on his father's door. A. says that there were nine Jeeps parked around his house. When he came to the door he was taken to an officer. "The officer said to me: 'Good evening.' I said: 'Good evening.' He said: 'What's your name? Whose father are you? How many children do you have? Give me their names, from oldest to youngest.' When I got to M., he said: 'Enough,'" A. related.

The officer introduced himself as the "captain" who arrested M. "He told me: 'I want you to come tomorrow, at 8:30 A.M., so I can give you a ticket to see your son. He's in a bad way. And bring him a change of clothes.' I told him: 'Okay, but give me another half-hour, until nine.' He said: 'Okay,'" A. continued his story.

The captain told him that he also intended to go to M.'s house to give his wife a ticket. A. pleaded with him not to wake his daughter-in-law, who was alone with the children. "It's one in the morning and she's alone with the children... she'll be afraid. I'll bring her with me, without a ticket. You have my word."

That morning M.'s father and wife took a taxi to the Etzion detention facility. They waited outside until noon, when M.'s wife was summoned and told to leave the package of clothing outside. A. was called in about half an hour later. "I went in there with the clothing, but they told me to leave it," A. said. "I went up to the second floor and saw my son's wife." A. was questioned briefly. His daughter-in-law told him that in the meantime she was taken into the husband's room. When M. tried to tell her not to worry and that he was innocent, the guards pushed him roughly. Their meeting lasted a few minutes.

A. continues: "Now they told me: Take off your kaffiyeh. They took it and put it on the chair. I'm a 63-year-old man. For us, this is our dignity. I don't have any hair. Two men came, one an Ethiopian [Jew], the other maybe Druze, speaking Arabic better than me: 'Kif halak, ya hajj?'. I told him I was fine. He said: Stand on the chair. I said: 'If the government tells me to stand on the chair, I'll stand on it.' The Ethiopian and the other one left and came back two minutes later with a torn and dirty coat that a dog wouldn't wear. I said: 'I have good clothes, why are you giving me this?' And one of them said: 'Stand up and put it on.' I said: 'It's the Israeli government, what can I do?' And they fastened the jacket so my clothes underneath wouldn't show. Only at the end did I figure out what it was. A movie."

The uniformed guards took A. by the arm on either side. "So it would look like I'm sick or something," A. continued. "Me, who hauled a refrigerator down from the tenth floor the other day. They took me to the stairs and told me to walk down each one - not more than 20 centimeters high - in two steps, as if I was sick or stiff. When I'm carrying a heavy washing machine, I take each step normally and they're telling me to take two steps each time.

A. and his two jailers, his co-stars in the show, went down to the yard, where A. was instructed to look up at the second-floor window. A. did not see his son, his eyesight is poor. A. was released immediately afterward. "That was the first film."

A. and his daughter-in-law returned home, leaving the clothes for M. they had brought. M.'s wife told A. that M. was standing at the window, thin and unshaven, when A. was in the yard in the prisoner's coat.

A week later, the telephone rang. It was the captain. He told A. to return to Etzion the next day, where he was questioned by an agent who introduced himself as his son's interrogator. A.: "He asked about my family. I have 15 children. It took two hours. At the end he said to me: What kind of work does M. do? And I told him: He rents a storage room and deals in furniture."

A week ago, security forces raided M.'s upholstery workshop. A. says that almost 20 Jeeps showed up for the operation. The soldiers broke the doors and windows and broke in, wreaking havoc.

We have seen the upholstery shop, and that is all it is, nothing more.

A prisoner who was released several days ago told A. that M. attempted suicide in prison and that his condition is serious. Perhaps M. wanted to put an end to his father's suffering, believing him to be ill and imprisoned on his account.

The IDF Spokesman's Office did not issue a response by press time.